Episode 5 "Shift from Activity to Relationships"

On this episode Pastor Trent talks about the importance of shifting from activity to relationships. He covers a dangerous assumption within churches. And walks through John 13:34-35, Mark 10:17-31, and Romans 12:10. He also challenges us to intentionally deepen a relationship through meaningful, christ-centered conversation.

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:02

Thanks for tuning in and welcome to the McKinley Avenue Discipleship Podcast. This podcast exists to help form faithful disciples for life, leadership, and living on mission.

SPEAKER_02 0:16

Hey everyone. Welcome back to the McKinley Avenue Discipleship Podcast. I'm your host, Trent Duncan. And today we're going to continue our conversation about the shifts that churches must make if we're serious about disciple making, based off of Jim Putman's book, Disciple Shift. And today's shift is this from activity to relationship. And so I think first off, when we think about shifting from activity to relationship, I think that scares a lot of people, honestly.

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I think that I think it scares people.

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And you know, I I think there's this assumption out there that quietly creeps into churches. And and I think I think it might even sound it kind of like this.

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If we're busy, then we're healthy.

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Well, if the calendar's full, then then we must be growing. If people are attending, we must be mature. But high activity levels don't, and they aren't the same as spiritual maturity, frankly. I if anything that I think true discipleship doesn't mirror a busy schedule, but I think that it mirrors intentional loving relationships, like what Jesus modeled. I think the question isn't just what are we doing, but I think the real question is how are we loving? And because discipleship moves beyond mere participation in programs or attendance or whatever, I I think that and it moves into really a deep and profound personal connection. And so, you know, I I think that when we think about shifting from activity to relationship, I think that scares a lot of people. Because I think for so long we've been taught when we're at church, we act this way. When we're a sporting event, we act this way. When we're at church, and when we're at home, we act this way. When we're out in public, we act this way. And and I think that we have segmented our lives and created almost masks or false personas depending upon which location. If if I'm at a sporting event, it's okay for me to yell and be mean and hateful towards officials. Or if I'm at church, well, I I I don't say anything. I just sit there and and I listen, being quiet and I try to be attentive, and that means I'm respectful and I'm growing in my faith. And and I don't always think that that's necessarily the case. I mean, let's let's think about the new command that we were given in John 13, 34, and 35. It says this, and a new command that I give to you that you should love one another, just as I have loved you, you are also to love one another, and by this all people will know that you are my disciples, if you have love for one another. Now, now think about that. Think about where this command sits. Okay, yeah, it's John chapter 13. But in John 13, Jesus had just washed the feet of the disciples. Okay, he just washed the disciples' feet. He's about to be destroyed or be betrayed by Judas. He's about he's predicted Peter's denial, and right in the middle of betrayal and weakness and failure, Jesus says, You should love one another. Even when people disappoint you, you should love one another. Even when they fail, you should love one another. Even when they hurt you, you should love one another. And it's easy to read it, it's easy to say it, right? It's it's much more difficult to live it out. And and I the command to love, it wasn't this new concept, okay? Like the Old Testament, it it called Israel to love their neighbor, right? And so it's not new. The the concept of love wasn't new, but what was new was really the standard, okay? Because it was just love your neighbor. But now Jesus, he raises the bar. It's not just love your neighbor, but it's love your neighbor as yourself, as you love yourself. And so, like he said, love one another. He didn't say love others as you love yourself, but what he said was love one another as I have loved you. He raises the bar. And and really that word love there in John 13, it's agape, right? It's that it's that agape love. It's self-giving, it's sacrificial, it's covenantal love. And like the distinguishing mark of discipleship isn't eloquence. The distinguishing mark of discipleship isn't church power. The distinguishing mark of discipleship isn't programs or events, the distinguishing mark of discipleship is Christ's love in us that allows us to love one another. And so, like, love creates a different kind of community. Okay, like now, like this kind of love doesn't create a click or a place of being siloed or, you know, churches are traditionally hammered and compared to cliques, and oh well, it's just a popular crowd, and it's this and it's that, and it's that, you know, and it and then a lot of that isn't anything. It a lot of that is is an unfortunate reality that is true, but if we're loving like Jesus loved, if we have love for one another like Jesus had love for us, it's not a kind of love that creates a click. This kind of love doesn't create a click. This kind of love, it doesn't produce an ingrown, an inward-focused, a self-centered church. In fact, the more Christ-like love that exists in a church, I think the more diversity you'll see in the church. Because we don't unite around personal preferences. We unite around Jesus Christ. And like our differences don't disappear, right?

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Our differences don't disappear, but they're seasoned with grace.

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And if if we don't love that way, then we risk becoming an echo chamber, only surrounding ourselves with people just like us, who think like us, who who want to be like us, who who live like us, who who ultimately are going to not tell us no or challenge us, or or not even just challenge us, but there's gonna be a lot of things that they're not able to do because we already agree. And so really what it does is it creates that echo chamber. It creates a situation where you're surrounded by a bunch of people who are gonna tell you yes, and not people who are gonna tell you no or challenge you or this or that. And I think it's a dangerous place to be. I I don't I personally don't think that's the body of Christ. Like the body of Christ is unified in Christ. It's diverse in expression, it's marked by love, right? Uh I love this quote. In matters of doctrine, unity, and matters of opinion, flexibility, but in all things, love. And so, like, here's a quick question that I think all of us have to ask ourselves. Where is Jesus asking me to raise the bar in my love? And I and here's what I think. I think once we have the answer to where is Jesus asking me to raise the bar in my love, once we have an answer to that question, then we know where growth and spiritual growth and spiritual maturity and spiritual depth, that's where that's going to begin.

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Because love, love is the identifier, right? Love is our our key metric. You will, I will know that they will know that you are my disciples by how you love.

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And so that's that's our key metric. Jesus said that the world would recognize his disciples by our love and by by our love for one another, not by our activity, but by our love. It's not a sentimental love, like, oh, I love you, we're best friends. No, it's not that. It's a self-sacrificing love. Okay, it's a it's a placing others' needs ahead of your own type of love.

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And lovelessness, the lack of love, in a church doesn't just create tension.

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It damages our witness for Jesus. Okay, and and I think that's why disciple making must be relational. It has to be relational. Everything in the church should funnel people toward environments where real relationships are forming, and especially in small group settings, because small groups are where shepherding happens, small groups are where real teaching happens. Small groups are where questions get asked, scripture is applied, accountability is modeled, and authenticity is safe. Like a small group isn't just another meeting, it's a relational discipleship environment. It's a place where leaders model shepherding and train others to shepherd. It's a place where the Bible isn't just read, but it's understood and it's lived out.

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And it's a place where love creates the safety needed for accountability and authenticity. But that doesn't happen apart from relationships.

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Strong relationships allow for small groups to allow shepherding and real teaching to happen and questions that get asked and scripture to be applied and accountability to be modeled.

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So here's why relationships matter so much. Because the enemy loves isolation.

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When someone sins or struggles or shame whispers in our ear, you're worse than anyone else. You're weird. Matter of fact, you're worse than everyone else. You've blown it too many times. You're just unusable. Don't let anybody see that. Oh my gosh, what will they think of you? And when shame wins, people withdraw. And they don't just withdraw from anything, but they withdraw specifically from God. They withdraw from community, they withdraw from their spiritual friendships, discipleship. But Ecclesiastes 4 9, it says this. It says, two are better than one. So sharing struggles breaks the power of secrecy. Authentic relationships protect us. They encourage us. They remind us of grace. And I think that's why discipleship must move from activity to relationships, because transformation doesn't happen when we're isolated and we're stuck in an echo chamber, but transformation happens when we are in a community committed to the word of Christ, accountable to one another, and allowing the word to get into us so that we can transform into a better likeness of Christ. So the real shift, right? From activity to relationships, many ministries continue year after year after year, really without a clear purpose. Now, you have heard the purpose of this podcast. This podcast exists to make fully formed disciples in life, leadership, and living on mission. And so, like, we have a clear purpose for this podcast. And so, like, they but many ministries have existed because they've always existed. But if they aren't producing loving, growing disciples, what are they producing? Like the church must align everything around a relational disciple-making picture. Because building relationships is both the means and the end. A genuine relationship with God should produce meaningful, loving relationships with other people, with especially other believers. Like we don't measure spiritual maturity by busyness, we measure spiritual maturity by how well we are loving one another. Because if we if we really think about it, true discipleship mirrors the intentional loving relationships that Jesus modeled. It moves beyond a what we do mentality into a how we love reality.

SPEAKER_00 15:09

Because activities can impress people, but relationships that's where transformation happens. And so, like, let's let's think about this a little bit. Okay, like like let's think about this. We're talking about shifting from activity to relationship. Ultimately, the central message should be that building relationships is the most effective way of discipleship.

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It's the most effective way of disciple making. Because a genuine relationship with God should translate into meaningful loving relationships with other people.

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Like we have to challenge the idea that busy church activity equals spiritual maturity. Right?

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Because loving others should be our primary activity. Especially loving people even when they're betraying you.

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Man, that is like the most loving thing that you can do. It's the most loving thing that we could do. Like, think about it. Think about that. Disciples of Jesus should be identified by their love.

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Building relationships is the core of discipleship with God, with others is the means and the end.

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But like we will know that we are his disciples by how we love. Okay. Mark Chapter ten, seven seventeen through twenty-two. Mark chapter ten, seventeen through twenty-two. Are you ready for that? I'm just kidding. There's no such thing as Mark seventeen. There's Mark ten. Seventeen through twenty-two. Here's what it says. And he was setting out on a journey, and a man ran up and knelt before him and asked, Good teacher, what do I what must I do to inherit eternal life?

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And Jesus said to him, Why do you call me good? No one is good except God alone. You know the commands. Do not murder, do not commit adultery, do not steal, do not bear false witness, do not defraud, honor your father and mother. And he said to them, Teacher, I have kept all these from my youth. And Jesus, looking at him, loved him and said to him, You lack one thing. Go, sell all your possessions, give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven, and come, follow me. Disheartened by the saying, he went away sorrowful, for he had great possessions. And Jesus looked around and said to his disciples, How difficult it will be for those who have wealth to enter the kingdom of God. And the disciples were amazed at his words. But Jesus said to them again, Children, how difficult is it to enter the kingdom of God? It's easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich person to enter the kingdom of heaven. And they were exceedingly astonished and said to him, Then who can be saved? And Jesus looked at them and said, With man it is possible, impossible, but with God, for all things are possible with God. And Peter began to say to him, See, we have left everything and followed you. And Jesus said, Truly I say to you, there is no one who has left house, or brothers, or sisters, or mother, or father, or children, or lands, for my sake and for the gospel, who will not receive a hundredfold now in this time. Houses and brothers and sisters and mothers and children and lands with persecutions, and in the age to come, eternal life. But many who are first will be last and last will be first. I went ahead and read all the way to verse 31. But like let's think about that for a second, okay? Like when we think about that interaction of Jesus and the rich young ruler, when we think about people, we will know that we are his disciples by how we love. Jesus is the whole point of discipleship. Jesus is the point of moving from activity to relationship. It's not about doing things for Jesus, it's about being with Jesus. And it's about as we're with Jesus and we're in Jesus' word and we're letting Jesus' spirit, the Holy Spirit, dwell within us, right? It changes how we think, how we act, how we prioritize. It changes how we live. It changes how we interact with other people. It changes anything and everything about how we operate. But moving from activity relationships, like we have to ask these questions like when was the last time someone spiritually challenged me?

SPEAKER_00 22:01

Because they loved me enough to be honest with me? Who are three to five people in my life that are intentionally transparent? That I'm intentionally transparent and accountable with.

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And the question is, if the answer for you is zero, like why? Even if you're introverted, like who is someone that you can disciple more intentionally?

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Even introverts like conversation sometimes.

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And like let's think about how is relationship and activity related? How are they different? Is there a balance between relationship and activity when it comes to discipleship? Like there's moments of relationship building, but there's also moments where we are doing things that strengthen our relationship.

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So, like I've got a couple challenges for you.

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The first challenge is this schedule time this week to meet with the person, meet with someone that you've shared your testimony with. Okay.

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And ask them an intentional probing question about their spiritual life. And sit there and actually listen to the answer. Don't listen just to respond. Listen to their answer. And from there, let that foster and blossom into a deep conversation. That's the first challenge. Here's another challenge, and maybe it's the same challenge, but maybe I'm a word a little bit different.

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Choose one person in your church or in a small group if you're a part of a small group, and intentionally deepen the relationship through a meaningful, Christ-centered conversation.

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Through a meaningful intentional Christ-centered conversation. Now, I'm gonna read some more scripture and then as we wrap up. And I'm going to read Romans 12.10. Which says this Love one another with brotherly affection. Outdo one another in showing honor. Thanks for listening today.

SPEAKER_02 25:01

This episode challenged you or encouraged you. Uh share it with someone who's passionate about discipleship. And as always, let's keep pursuing Christ likeness together. See you next time. Hey, thanks for tuning in to the McKinley Avenue Discipleship Podcast. Uh, we hope that this episode has been helpful for you and has helped form you as a faithful disciple of Jesus Christ.